In The Arena: Joel Pedersen

September 3, 2024

TRCP’s “In the Arena” series highlights the individual voices of hunters and anglers who, as Theodore Roosevelt so famously said, strive valiantly in the worthy cause of conservation

Joel Pedersen

Hometown: A Nebraskan at heart.
Occupation: President and CEO of the Theodore Roosevelt Conservation Partnership.
Conservation credentials: Joel Pedersen is a life-long hunter, angler and conservationist. His professional background includes biological administration, hunting access program management, conservation planning, and federal and state legislative strategy. He has served in leadership positions at the Mule Deer Foundation, National Wild Turkey Federation and the Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission and holds degrees in biology and wildlife and fisheries science. He is also a fellow of the National Conservation Leadership Institute.

Inspired from a young age and through a life of hunting, fishing, and conservation leadership, Joel is driven by a personal responsibility to protect America’s legacy of conservation, habitat, and access to ensure quality places to hunt and fish for future generations.

Here is his story.

I grew up in rural Nebraska.  Both sets of my grandparents were farmers, and I spent a lot of time as a youngster playing in the pastures and streams that wove through their farms.  My earliest memories of spending time outdoors were forged there. 

As I grew, my father took me fishing for bass and panfish on the Missouri River and in the small reservoirs and farm ponds of northeast Nebraska.  Soon, I began eagerly looking forward to our annual trips to see extended family in Minnesota, because with it came the opportunity to fish for walleye.  Before I was able to carry a shotgun, I was introduced to Nebraska’s pheasants (and the occasional bobwhite or hun) – these were the only real hunting opportunities we had in the 1970’s and 80’s – and that is where I got my start as a hunter.  I bagged my first pheasant at age 10 and I was hooked.    Since then, my fondest memories have involved the outdoors in some way – from taking my kids hunting or fishing for the first time to exploring new areas and the uniqueness of America’s public lands, each holds a special place for me. Even today, autumn Saturdays in the field, listening to Cornhusker football between hunts, still bring me back to those special, formative days.

“I’m honored that I get to bring my lifelong passions to an organization named after Theodore Roosevelt, the person that brought conservation to the forefront as an American value in the early 20^th century.”
Joel Pedersen, TRCP president and CEO

I became active in Boy Scouts as I got older, and, fortunately, my troop went camping every month, year-round.  Once, while on a trip to Philmont in New Mexico, we had a black bear raid our camp during breakfast.  This was a big deal for a kid from Nebraska! I had never seen a wild animal bigger than a coyote and I immediately had to know more about this incredible species. At that moment, I made it my life’s goal to do just that, ultimately leading me to graduate school research on the black bears in Tennessee’s Smoky Mountains. This experience ignited a fire for conservation in me and it was a defining moment that kickstarted my pursuit of an incredible profession. 

As my career progressed, I was fortunate to learn from many great mentors and experience many exciting places. During my tenure at the National Wild Turkey Federation, I became a passionate turkey hunter. I’ll never forget, after many failed attempts, finally calling in and harvesting a turkey on my own – to top it off, it was a Sumter National Forest, South Carolina turkey.  Although many places claim to have the most challenging turkey hunting, I will put a South Carolina public lands bird up against any for that title!  

“I want to ensure that future generations can have the same opportunities and experiences that I have had.  It’s important to me that more of the public understand the impact that conservation has on them and how hunters and anglers have always been at its heart. ”
Joel Pedersen, TRCP president and CEO

Nowadays, when I think about places to hunt and fish, I reflect upon my roots. I appreciate the nostalgia and the memories that my time outdoors has provided. I’m a Nebraskan at heart and I still have a passion for pheasant hunting in the open fields of the Midwest - unfortunately, there is only one hunting spot from my youth that has not been tilled under in the last 40 years – and I hold many great memories of family fishing trips in Minnesota and Canada close. As I look ahead, I’m intrigued by the challenge, environment, and natural beauty of a high mountain sheep or goat hunt. I have never done it, but it is an adventure that I’d like to experience.  

However, for me, it is not the species or the location alone that is important anymore.  It is the chance to spend time alone in the field, recharging and reflecting on why I am so passionate about conservation. It is time in the field with good people, creating memories, and hopefully inspiring others to be part of our conservation movement that drives me.  

I don’t know a life without conservation.  It is at the center of my career, and at the center of my down time.  I can’t imagine what time in the field, forests, or waters would be like without it. Could we have the same experiences without the national forests that were originally set aside by Theodore Roosevelt? Without the restoration of game species that were pioneered and funded by hunters? Without public lands that were purchased by duck stamps, wildlife stamps, and Pittman–Robertson Act / Dingell-Johnson Act funds? I want to ensure that future generations can have the same opportunities and experiences that I have had.  It’s important to me that more of the public understand the impact that conservation has on them and how hunters and anglers have always been at its heart. 

“We must persevere by investing and collectively striving to ensure quality places to hunt and fish for our future generations…Conservation impacts everyone.”
Joel Pedersen, TRCP president and CEO

Look at the arc of history in our landscapes and the wildlife that live in them.  So many game species were once on the brink of extinction, and the efforts of hunters, anglers, and conservationists brought them back– in some cases to record numbers!  But the challenges to wildlife, fish, and habitat are more numerous than ever before.  It is up to us to lead in this moment so we can protect what those before us provided.  We must continue to educate, and more importantly, thoughtfully engage so that hunting, fishing, and conservation will continue to have a bright future. 

We can’t take our natural landscapes and wildlife species for granted – I am often concerned that too many people (including hunters and anglers) don’t understand how the dedication of previous generations has gotten us here. We must persevere by investing and collectively striving to ensure quality places to hunt and fish for our future generations.  Beyond that, we need to raise awareness with the greater public about how conservation affects them – whether they enjoy the land and water directly, or they just appreciate clean air and clean water.  Conservation impacts everyone.  

Beyond the fact that I have made this my career, and it has allowed me to raise a family and make innumerable like-minded friends, conservation has always been my passion.  It’s cliche, but when you show up every day to a job you are passionate about, it never seems like work.  While that’s been the case for me, being involved in conservation goes far beyond that. Giving back to the wildlife and the landscapes that have provided so many great memories are of paramount importance to me. I’m honored (and it’s pretty cool!) that I get to bring my lifelong passions to an organization named after Theodore Roosevelt, the person that brought conservation to the forefront as an American value in the early 20^th century. It is extremely humbling, and I look forward to working alongside the talented team at TRCP to further our collective vision.   

The TRCP is your resource for all things conservation. In our weekly Roosevelt Report, you’ll receive the latest news on emerging habitat threats, legislation and proposals on the move, public land access solutions we’re spearheading, and opportunities for hunters and anglers to take action. Sign up now.

Do you have any thoughts on this post?

Click here to cancel reply.

by: Noah Davis

posted in: In the Arena

August 29, 2024

In The Arena: DeAnna Bublitz

TRCP’s “In the Arena” series highlights the individual voices of hunters and anglers who, as Theodore Roosevelt so famously said, strive valiantly in the worthy cause of conservation

DeAnna Bublitz

Hometown: Apple Valley, MN
Occupation: Microbiologist
Conservation credentials: DeAnna Bublitz is the founder of DEER Camp, a gear library for hunters based in Missoula, Montana.

DeAnna Bublitz grew up in Minnesota enjoying the many state parks and open farmland the North Star state has to offer. When she moved to Montana in 2012, Bublitz wanted to become more intentional and involved with her meat consumption. She asked a friend if they would loan her gear and show her the ropes of hunting. The rest is history. Since that influential first season, Bublitz has founded DEER Camp, an organization that aims to reduce some of the financial hurdles by providing a gear library for hunters.

Here is her story.

My parents introduced me to the outdoors. They weren’t backpackers or anything, but we’d go car camping at various Minnesota state parks and on my grandparent’s farmland in Wisconsin. I grew up with a big backyard near a pond that let me perfect my frog-catching abilities. My parents also sent me to summer camps which were a major player in getting me into the outdoors. I learned to canoe and backpack at the Wolf Ridge Environmental Center in northern Minnesota, and this foundation led me to taking weeklong backpacking trips with friends along the Superior Hiking Trail in high school.

Hunting came later when I moved to Montana in 2012. After going trap shooting with my landlord (and realizing I wasn’t as terrible as I’d imagined I’d be) I wanted to see if I could be more intentional and involved with my meat consumption. So I reached out to my only friend here at the time, a friend I’d met ages ago at that same summer camp, to see if she and her husband would loan me gear and show me the ropes of hunting. And the rest is history.

I think one of my most memorable outdoor adventures was my first solo backpacking trip. I go hunting alone quite a bit, but those are always day trips or maybe to a Forest Service cabin. But just a few years ago I finally did a longer backpacking trip just myself and my dog and it was wonderful. We did a 20-mile loop over three nights in southern Montana where I didn’t pass anyone on the trail until the last three miles. My campsite for two nights was in an elk wintering ground, and they had clearly only vacated recently because their tracks and scent were all over. It was beautiful and empowering to be in that vast of a landscape with no one but my dog.

A Canadian or Alaskan moose hunt would be a dream. The landscape is just incredible so even if I didn’t get anything, I’d come away happy. And pulling a moose tag in Montana is a test of your patience and longevity.

Bublitz works on a trail crew in Montana’s Scapegoat Wilderness.

Conservation enhances my outdoor life by making it possible. Generations of advocates came before me, and they are why the large tracts of land I recreate on are available to everyone. From Missoula-local trails like Mt. Sentinel and Mt. Jumbo, to the Scapegoat Wilderness, these spaces have been conserved for recreation and wildlife alike because of conservation-minded folks.

From an early age it was instilled in me that we are all stewards of our surroundings, so being engaged with conservation issues was a natural course.
DeAnna Bublitz

One of the biggest conservation challenges in my area is development, which is maybe not what a lot of folks think about when they imagine Montana. But we have been growing population-wise for some time and the boom that came in the last few years has really put a crunch on housing. People aren’t moving here so they can live in denser cities; they want their private 20-acre ranchette on prime valley land or high up in the mountains, both options necessitating new driveways, roads, power lines, and fences. All which disrupt wildlife corridors. Wrapped up in development is every other issue you might think of facing conservation: more driving miles because folks still need to get groceries, go to the doctor, get their kids to school, and all of these activities lead to habitat fragmentation, introduction of noxious weeds, wildlife conflict, and changing attitudes of about land use, management, and access.

Bublitz with her first deer, a mule deer buck.

From an early age it was instilled in me that we are all stewards of our surroundings, so being engaged with conservation issues was a natural course. The simplest reason I’m invested in conservation is that I use and love these outdoor spaces and by extension, I care for what lives there and want it to be healthy. But I also want these places to be available for other folks in the future to discover and fall in love with. And at least in Montana, it feels really easy to get involved and create community around conservation. In a very short time, I’ve made connections with so many regional and statewide nonprofits, I am on the Board of Directors for our local rod and gun club, and these connections and activities help me stay engaged and energized in a way that is long lasting and sustainable.

Most hunters and anglers I know aren’t just in it for the harvest, so while conservation should matter for simply ensuring healthy populations of these game animals, it’s about more than that. Hunting and fishing are ways to get into the outdoors and see new places, take photos of beautiful sunrises, and more often than not, see all manner of critters that aren’t the ones you’re actually looking for. Conservation work creates better habitat for the animals we hunt and fish and subsequently, healthier populations of those animals. The efforts put into conserving the habitats of game animals typically benefits all of the other organisms that exist in those same environments, but it also makes for healthy landscapes to soak in when you’re out there and untying your line from a tree or taking your rifle for walk.

Photos Courtesy of DeAnna Bublitz.

by: Ryan Lockwood

posted in: In the Arena

August 13, 2024

In the Arena: Capt. Tyler Nonn

TRCP’s “In the Arena” series highlights the individual voices of hunters and anglers who, as Theodore Roosevelt so famously said, strive valiantly in the worthy cause of conservation.

Tyler Nonn

Hometown: Cape Charles, Virginia
Occupation: Fishing guide and owner/operator of Tidewater Charters
Conservation credentials: Nonn can be counted on to be vocal about menhaden conservation at meetings of the Virginia Marine Resources Commission, in TRCP-led advocacy pushes, and other Chesapeake Bay conservation issues.

Capt. Tyler Nonn runs Tidewater Charters, a fly fishing and light tackle angling operation in the Chesapeake Bay that gets clients onto striped bass, redfish, speckled trout, and cobia. He offers a critical captain’s perspective on the importance of healthy menhaden populations when decision-makers are considering policy decisions. Nonn, a Simms ambassador who winters in the Florida Keys to target sportfish dependent on a healthy Everglades ecosystem, has been featured in The Venturing Angler and Flylords Mag.

Here is his story.

Growing up as a kid in the Upper Chesapeake Bay, I had two avenues to fish all the time. My family’s farm had a small pond on it and just as I was getting old enough to really appreciate good fishing, the moratorium on striped bass was first lifted. Upper Bay seasons were created that allowed me and many other anglers to enjoy the eruption of giant fish on the shallow flats and rivers creating some of the best fishing you could ask for. So between ponds, phenomenal Bay fishing, and crabbing with my father and friends the outdoors consumed me and all my time.

“I still come back to the Chesapeake… because chasing the inshore species that call this place home is my passion.”

Probably my most memorable outdoor experience was working in Alaska through the summers of my early 20s. Coming from the East Coast, it was very different and exciting to learn completely new techniques and to apply them to a fishery far from anything I had ever experienced.

I have been fortunate to travel and fish in a lot of places in this country and in several others. But I still come back to the Chesapeake not only because my business is here, but because chasing the inshore species that call this place home is my passion. Giant striped bass, redfish, cobia, speckled trout, and other species make it nearly a year-round fishery.

Like everywhere the Bay has plenty of problems. The biggest conservation challenge we have here, in my opinion, is the division or separation within the user groups of our natural resources. I feel like this is common in many places. In the end everyone wants more fish in one way or another, but the separation of user groups makes fisheries issues very politically charged, and more often than not really difficult to get anything positive accomplished.

I watch the intense harvest of “bunker,” or Atlantic menhaden, most of the year in the lower portions of the Bay and near coastal waters. As far as the impact on sportfishing goes, when the bait is present it completely changes the landscape of fishing. Fish hold consistently in areas when bait like menhaden are abundant. Then as it diminishes fish move out of areas nearly instantly. Even the differences in fishing conditions from Virginia to Maryland portions of the Bay are incredibly different, even sometimes just a few miles apart.

Conservation directly impacts my entire life and everything in it. Without fish and the opportunity to catch them, I wouldn’t have my business – or more importantly, fuel to feed my lifelong passion. It’s important for myself and everyone to be involved in conservation because it’s our legacy as anglers. I really enjoy fishing, to say the least, and I want others to be able to have the same experiences that I have been able to have, or even better in the future.

“Everyone should have the future of our fisheries in mind.”

Just like generations before us, and the generations to come, everyone should have the future of our fisheries in mind. Fishermen are some of the greatest conservationists and supporters of wildlife, and hunters as well. This will no doubt be our saving grace as time marches on and people continue to want to enjoy the outdoors.

Photo credits: Tyler Nonn

Learn more about menhaden and herring as critical forage fish species.

by: Dan Morgan

posted in: In the Arena

July 18, 2024

In the Arena: Wade Fellin

TRCP’s “In the Arena” series highlights the individual voices of hunters and anglers who, as Theodore Roosevelt so famously said, strive valiantly in the worthy cause of conservation.

Wade Fellin

Hometown: Wise River, Montana
Occupation: Big Hole Lodge Co-Owner/Guide/Outfitter, Photographer
Conservation credentials: Wade Fellin is an established guide, outfitter, and cold-water fisheries advocate. As a founding member of Save Wild Trout, Fellin works with a coalition of anglers, river advocates, citizens, and businesses to protect wild trout for the benefit of all by developing science-based solutions aimed at protecting cold-water fisheries for future generations.

A native Montanan, Wade Fellin has spent his life exploring, guiding, and stewarding the wild, trout-rich rivers of Montana’s Big Hole Valley. Concerned about the declining health of Montana’s wild trout fisheries due to climate change and other factors, Fellin has worked with Save Wild Trout to address the urgent need for conservation actions to preserve these vital natural resources and to coalesce a community around the shared values of clean water and vibrant, healthy rivers.

Here is his story.

My father joined the Marine Corps and went to Vietnam, and when he got back, he moved to Missoula, Montana in 1974. He worked as a security guard at the airport and on his lunch breaks, he hung out at the Streamside Angler, then owned by Frank Johnson and Rich Anderson. They gave him all the advice he needed to hone his skills as a fly fisher and he fished between shifts in a white shirt, tie, and black slacks on these rivers.

He headed to Aspen, Colorado in 1978 and guided for Chuck Fothergill. While in Aspen, Dad met my mom, a Bozeman native whose family helped found Wisdom, Montana on the upper Big Hole, and they decided to start a fly-fishing lodge. In 1983, with Fothergil’s blessing, they headed north through Wyoming, Idaho, and Montana searching for their perfect spot and founded their business on the banks of the Wise River, just up from the Big Hole River. Back then the caddis hatches looked like snowstorms. The salmon fly hatches were so thick cars would slide driving through the canyon. At that time, there were very few people on the water.

I came along in the summer of ’88, the year of the Yellowstone fire. Mom and Dad strapped my bassinet to their 14’ Avon raft and fishing was just part of life. I spent my childhood exploring the Wise River with a fly rod and my teens rowing the Big Hole and surrounding rivers. Now, with 18 years of guiding under my belt, I’m partnered with my father in a business he has spent 40 years nurturing. But now, the future of Montana’s wild trout fisheries is uncertain, and the rivers need all the help they can get.

My most memorable outdoor adventure served to fuel my drive to help ensure that Montana’s natural resources are here for future generations to enjoy. About six years ago, I met a friend at Bridger Bowl after a big snowstorm. We hiked to the ridge from the top of the chairlift and traversed out to a run we’d skied since we were kids. He dropped in first, into the couloir, under the cliffs, and out of sight. I dropped in and turned hard at the end of the chute to slide out over a fresh run. Unseasonably warm weather the week before opened the snowpack to a ground spring, or a melt-out, below the cliff invisible under two feet of new snow. I hit the outer wall of the crevasse hard and fell backward, upside-down and snow collapsed in with me. Everything was dark and I couldn’t breathe. For the first time in my life, I considered that I had lived my entire life. Then adrenaline and sheer will took over and I inched my way to a clear airway. To that point I’d taken my life in the outdoors for granted, as if it’d always be there. And naively, that I’d be here for a long time. So as long as I am here, I’m going to do what I can to make sure the rich outdoors heritage of Montana is here too.

The Big Hole Valley and the Big Hole River holds an important place in my heart having spent most of my life fishing and hunting this valley. As Edward Abbey said, “it’s not enough to protect the land, you must also enjoy it.”

Without conservation, none of us will have the opportunity to enjoy the outdoors the way we do now. You don’t have to look far to find an organization working toward a healthy outdoors future and it really doesn’t matter which one you join – they all need your help, and we all need their work.

Climate change exacerbates everything affecting our fisheries. It was encouraging to hear Gov. Gianforte and Montana Fish, Wildlife, and Parks identify warmer water temperatures combined with low flows as the primary drivers behind the southwest Montana trout declines. Adding elevated levels of nutrient pollution to those conditions becomes a deadly mix of aquatic life and wild trout. We must come together to address this shared challenge. The decline of wild trout in southwest Montana’s cold-water fisheries isn’t something new. We’ve been tracking the downward trend with Montana Fish, Wildlife, and Parks, and our partners at the Big Hole River Foundation, and we have been raising concerns for over half a decade. It’s just that now we’ve hit a make-or-break point with population numbers at, or near, historic lows with the prospect of the fishery making a recovery now in our hands. I still have hope that after this winter’s already record-breaking warmth and low snowpack, we can put down our differences to coalesce around our shared values of clean water and vibrant, healthy rivers. There is more that unites us than divides us, so let’s acknowledge our shared challenge and get to work protecting the resources that provide for our way of life and livelihoods.

This isn’t about me, the lodge, or fly fishing, for that matter. This is about us, our communities, and what they will look like next year, the year after that, and for future generations. We like to say Montana is “Next-Year-Country,” and I’d argue, particularly in southwest Montana, we are snowpack country. Snowpack sustains our limited clean water resources, and it is the foundation that drives nearly every aspect of our economy and well-being. When we set out to launch Save Wild Trout it was abundantly clear that our mission was simple: To protect wild trout now and for future generations. The values and connection to our waters and lands provided to me through fly fishing, hunting, and the outdoors is an opportunity I want my kids to have and enjoy.

Conservation, hunters, and anglers go together like a hand in a glove. Much of the work to protect and conserve our lands, waters, and wildlife was and continues to be borne out of the hunting and angling communities. The next generation must carry the conservation mantle forward, and there are few better ways than getting them out hunting on public lands or in a boat fishing public water. It’s the values that were passed down to me from my father and something I’ll pass on to my son. How we respond to this crisis and address the new reality of climate change in our fisheries management paradigms can be and should be a success story for future conservationists.

Do you know someone “In the Arena” who should be featured here? Email us at info@trcp.org

by: Noah Davis

posted in: In the Arena

July 11, 2024

In The Arena: Erin Block

TRCP’s “In the Arena” series highlights the individual voices of hunters and anglers who, as Theodore Roosevelt so famously said, strive valiantly in the worthy cause of conservation

Erin Block

Hometown: Golden, CO
Occupation: Librarian
Conservation credentials: Erin Block is an established outdoor writer and has published her work in publications such as Gray’s Sporting Journal, Midcurrent, and Field & Stream, alongside her books The View from Coal Creek and By a Thread: A Retrospective on Women and Fly Tying. She also serves as editor-at-large for TROUT magazine, and her first collection of poetry How You Walk Alone in the Dark recently won a Colorado Book Award.

As a Nebraska farm kid showing 4-H steers and dairy goats, Erin Block was raised to understand where food comes from, but it wasn’t until she moved to Colorado that she started hunting grouse, hares, and turkeys on the public lands around her home. A celebrated writer who grapples with the complexities of hunting and surrounding culture, Block offers a unique perspective with talent that grips her readers.

Here is her story.

Block with a high-country Merriam’s in an early season snowstorm.

I grew up in the Midwest, in Nebraska and Iowa, and spent time fishing with my dad. But no one in my immediate family hunted. We lived on a small farm, and I spent my childhood riding horses, raising 4-H steers and dairy goats. After college, I moved to Denver, Colorado, and that’s when I started hiking and backpacking. As a kid, I took it for granted that I knew where some of my food was coming from. As an adult, I started to realize that I wanted to get back to that in some way, but a farm was out of my financial means. So I started foraging mushrooms and then hunting. I started small, working my way up in animal and weapon size each season: first for grouse, then snowshoe hare, jackrabbit, turkey, and mule deer.

This past October, my husband, Jay Zimmerman, and I took our recurve bows out to hunt snowshoe hare. There was new snow that had fallen overnight and there was no wind. The hare tracks were fresh and it was magical to move through the woods so quietly as a predator. It felt like a lucid dream.

I am very much a homebody and don’t like traveling. I’m attached to my home waters and hunting grounds and would always choose them over anywhere else: the Front Range and eastern plains of Colorado.

Conservation is essential for being able to continue to hunt and fish. Good habitat creates better opportunities for hunters and anglers, but also improves the health of the ecosystem and animal populations. Every hunter knows the stomach-sinking-feeling of returning to an area you have had past success in and finding corners of a field mowed, timber cut, water drained, thickets torn up.

I’m lucky to live in an area with many public lands, but each year, more empty plots are developed, and the weather has become predictably unpredictable. I’ve witnessed severe drought, 1,000-year floods, and wildfires in my area all within a short span of time. Without a doubt the climate is changing and if we can create and maintain good habitat through conservation practices, that will help all animals through the coming years. There are also just a lot more people on the landscape. This isn’t a bad thing, but I think we all need to be mindful that even if we don’t view an activity as consumptive—hiking, for example—we are still impacting the land and its inhabitants, possibly detrimentally so.

Block chases dusky grouse in the Front Range of Colorado.

It’s important to me to try to have a positive impact on the resources I use and enjoy and also the small area of land where I live. I plant fruit trees, leave brush piles for rabbits, encourage the growth of native plants such as wild raspberries for pollinators, and so on. In less than a decade of hunting turkey, I have noticed a decrease in songbird activity at sunrise. Hunting takes you to places where you notice small changes like that, and makes you want to do something about it. In an interview with Orion Magazine, the poet Ross Gay was asked what he’d most like to be remembered for and his answer always sticks with me: “I am glad to have planted trees.”

Conservation should matter to us and to the next generation because even if you don’t fish or hunt, the health of our ecosystems directly affects our own well-being, both physically and mentally. And even for non-game species, we should care about their right to exist and their contribution to ecosystems. To quote Aldo Leopold, “keep all the pieces.”

Photos Courtesy of Erin Block.